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By ajnegus
#3596
Hello everyone

I apologise if this question has already been asked a million times but I can't seem to find the right answer.

I'm just starting out in trying to learn upholstery with the eventual aim of re-trimming a set of Recaro seats. I didn't want to invest too much money to begin with in case I was no good at trimming so I decided to start off with a heavy duty domestic machine. I bought myself a Singer 4432 and began to practice using vinyl and hoped to work my way up to using leather at a later date once I'd got my skills honed and my patterns correct.

My first efforts were ok considering I'd never even touched a sewing machine before but I am having some problems which mostly seem to be due to the sewing machine. It copes fine with physically sewing the vinyl but I find that the machine is too fast to allow good control and precision, I think it runs at something like 1100 spm. I have also found that there is not enough space under the presser foot to be able to sew the top stitching on French seams and as a result the stitches get bunched up and uneven and I get a lot of jams. I bought a voltage controller to try to slow the machine down but its still too fast and I bought a walking foot to try to help the materials feed through better but its now pretty obvious that my machine isn't suitable for what I want to do. I therefore wondered if anyone could give me some advice on the best type of machine for the job.

Here is a picture of my first attempt at a bolster, I know the top stitching is awful but that's due to the problems mentioned above, the machine runs too fast and is very difficult to control and get it to go in a straight line and the machine doesn't cope well with thick materials and can't pull them through easily. I also need to make a few adjustments to my pattern and to remove some material from the seam on the reverse side to follow the curves better, its my first attempt so it was bound to be less than good.
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I don't really have the space for a full size industrial machine to be permanently set up but I guess if this is the only suitable option I will have to try to find a solution. I was wondering if anyone had any opinions about the Sailrite machines? To me they look a bit old fashioned and are very expensive for what they are but they do seem to do the job and they are at least compact enough to be stored away when not in use. I have read about the cheaper Chinese copies and it looks as though they are a false economy but I wondered if anyone had any experience of the Omega versions of this type of machine? http://walking-foot.com/

I suppose what I really need is something with plenty of space under the foot and a machine that is able to run nice and slow to give me the precision I need. I will be working with leather and some upholstery fabrics and a maximum foam thickness of around 15mm. Any advice would be much appreciated, this is the kind of thing I would eventually like to achieve:
90238421a3938fe2a19ac06fc21a300d.jpg
90238421a3938fe2a19ac06fc21a300d.jpg (73.41 KiB) Viewed 21079 times

thanks very much
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By Kra z Bill
#3597
I too went with a Singer, I got the 4452 and found it to be less then adequate. I looked into the sailrite as well. and found that they were more than what I could afford. I then looked into some of the knock offs and wound up buying a REX 607. But I found that as it comes from Amazon it too ran way too fast for me to keep up with. So I took a portable machine and turned it into a table machine, removed the motor and installed this one https://www.sailrite.com/Sailrite-Workh ... Motor-110V and now I have total control. and any accessories that fit the sailrite also fit on the REX 607. Also the 607 is the same as the LS1, and the 607Z is the same as the LSZ1. The 607 and the 607Z They are way cheaper, but the sailrite itself is a better machine because it has been improved since it was first released. My plans are to use the REX till I know for sure if I am going to keep doing this and buy a better one at a later date. Possibly the Sailrite Fabricator. Or a nice Juki.
By IvanD
#3598
Discussed a lot here: viewtopic.php?f=5&t=250

I would look for used before buyuing anything new. For example, in our area right now: https://stlouis.craigslist.org/for/d/br ... 58163.html

That machine or alike will get your issues solved. Speed reducing is another question but it's doable.
3 things:
1. Compound feed walking foot
2. Industrial
3. Servo motor (can be clutch too, you can upgrade for $100)

Trust me, it is not that easy to sew at beginning even if you have great machine. Using incorrect equipment is just shooting yourself into the leg. Making headrests with french seams like on picture above is hard(if not impossible) with table sewing machine, not even talking about non-industrial ones.
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By Jayscanvas
#3599
If you Are looking for portable machine the sailrite ultra feed with the monster wheel is the way to go. I started with one and did full canvas enclosures with it. The good thing about the sailrite is they hold there value and sell quickly if you want to upgrade in the future.
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By ajnegus
#3604
many thanks for all the help and advice, much appreciated. I was hoping to find a used Sailrite but they seem to be quite scarce, particularly here in the UK and I'm reluctant to spend nearly $1000 on a new one if I turn out to be crap at trimming. I can find used industrial machines here for about £500 so perhaps one of those would be the best option, would something like this be suitable?

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Leather-Sewi ... rk:12:pf:0
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By Cale
#3605
I bought the Sailrite LSZ for my first machine. It is easy to use, well built and has plenty of power. May cost more upfront but well worth it once you get into some thick material.

Only downside that I have found is that right out of the box it is hard to control the speed. Takes some practice to get control of it. Sailrite has a servo motor and table explained in a post above that apparently will help with the control of the machine. It is an extra $499 but again, looks to be worth the price. I am on a budget as well and have not got it for that reason. But be assured, that as soon as I have an opportunity to get one I will.

As beginners we are all on budgets and are looking for the best bang for our bucks. But, as I have learned in life, if you want to play you gotta pay. So, with that, buy a good machine upfront and if you decide not to go further then it is better to lose a little on a good machine instead of alot on a machine that has zero resale value.
By ajnegus
#3606
that's really useful information, thanks very much. Did you get the Monster Wheel on your Sailrite? I was under the impression that this makes the machine go nice and slowly but perhaps its still not as slow as you'd need for real precision.
By davemac2
#3612
Another possibility for a cheaper starter machine that is better than the sailrite or its clones (I think) could be the Tacsew GC-6 walking foot if you can find it. It has been discontinued but is still available at some sites:
http://industrialsewingmachineman.com/m ... h+Machines

$700 new with table and motor. It uses std 135x16/135z17 needles and 111W feet I believe.

http://www.american-sewing.com/tacsew-gc6-6.html
John liked this
By Joemcglynn
#3618
For what it’s worth... and take it with a grain of salt since I’m a beginner, the consew 206rb5 with the servo motor has been great for me so far. $1,300 with free shipping from upholster.com. I added a 50mm pulley from eBay and it’s super controllable. Enough torque to start slow and I can just cruise along nice and feathering the treadle. I have the motor on the slowest speed, and even in that range it will go faster than I could handle if I floored it - so there is plenty of speed in the upper ranges even with the small pulley. I’ve seen four lawyer of vinyl and two layers of heavy leather (about 1/8”thick per layer) with no issues. No where near it’s capacity.

I know that’s a lot of money, but I had a portable walking foot machine 15 years ago that I couldn’t make work right. Probably 90% me, not having @John’s videos :smiley:, but I think it was quirky at best. I didn’t want to get a machine I would have to upgrade from quickly, and I didn’t want a machine that might need attention to get working properly. This was the best option for me. Your mileage may vary.
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By ajnegus
#3620
thanks again for all the help everyone. I think I will try to find myself a used industrial machine, some of the machines mentioned are not so easy to find in the UK but I have seen a few Seiko machines at reasonable prices, the STW and LSW, which seem to be well made and reliable machines that you can still find parts for. Alternatively I will try to find something like a Singer 211.

Are twin needle machines worth considering? I just thought they'd be good for top stitching French seams, I was wondering about the Singer 212, presumably you can disable one needle and use it as a single needle machine when required.

thanks again
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By BigRig
#3628
@ajnegus ,

Regarding the double needle unless you are running a lot of projects where you need to maximize time I do not think you would benefit from a double needle.
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By davemac2
#3630
I just scored a used consew 206rb5 for $300 with servo and table. Now that's a great deal. :grin: So they are out there. You just need to keep looking for a few months.
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By John
#3650
I agree with @BigRig double needles are not worth the money and space unless you are doing a lot french seam work.

@davemac2 That's awesome! What a great deal. How did you find that one? Craigslist?
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By Smooooth
#3673
I to am very new to both the forum and upholstery.

I have since lost my notes, but afters days of reading and watching videos, and months of stalking Craigslist, Facebook Market Place, Letgo, etc. etc. etc., I finally found one of the three models I was looking for at a very very attractive price.

It was down a Singer, Consew, and ultimately a Brother LS2-B837. (I wish I could find my notes)

This video is what sealed the deal:


Large Bobbin, Oil Reservoirs (Not Bath), Repeatable Stitch Length Selection, Common Parts, and the list goes on.

Again, I'm just a newbie...... But my research and patience paid off to the tune of $250. I do want to upgrade to a Servo Motor shortly.

Fortunately, I convinced myself that I was in no rush!!!

Enjoy the journey,
Stephen
Smooooth Creations

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By IvanD
#3674
How long did you wait? I was waiting for 4 month and nothing came up locally. Eventually got pfaff 1245 used from dealer for $900. With servo already. Love machine still monitor local CL and it’s been 6 months now - nothing for sale
By davemac2
#3697
John wrote: Mon Dec 03, 2018 10:57 pm @davemac2 That's awesome! What a great deal. How did you find that one? Craigslist?
It was listed on 'LetGo' as a cryptic kind of listing. Not very clear. However he did have a marginal picture and I was able to ID the machine as the 206RB. He said he had gotten it as payment for a job from some lady. It was missing a few things but all minor. When I search for these machines, I search under all kinds of titles. In my area (Sacramento), I find they come up about once every 6 weeks or so, more typically in the Bay area. I now have a Singer 111W153 and a 111G156 I'm going to be selling soon. Both sew great as well. :)
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By Smooooth
#3698
davemac2 wrote: When I search for these machines, I search under all kinds of titles.
Great point to bring out for sure!!! (Should be a sticky of some sort)

Searching hints and tips.............

On my phone I use CPlus for Craigslist
On the PC I go to SearchTempest for Craigslist - Can use and/or phrases
Facebook Market Place, Letgo, OfferUp.....................
I try to stay away from eBay except for pricing research.

Lots of flexibility in searching.

Main terms I 'started' with are:
Industrial Sewing
Commercial Sewing
Heavy Sewing
Leather Sewing (you might be surprised what shows up)

I have found many many sellers that do not know what they are selling. Acquired through some means or other.
Countless times I have seen a single picture of the back side of a machine. Most have a hard time finding a Model Number.
These are also the bargain units!!! Some times you need to help educate those that feel they are sitting on a small fortune. For some of the 'Home' machines that I have purchased, I have very kindly left a offer on the table and waited. Sometimes the seller will come back and accept that offer a few weeks later.

Right now, for my Singer 112WSV110, I am searching for a Solid Wood Table with H Legs. It will probably end up coming with a machine that I really have no interest in. Although it might come with a collectable light and early thread stand. Time and patience will tell.

Stephen
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