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By rdoty
#11743
I'm not new to sewing but this is my first experience with marine vinyl and right away I'm having difficulty. My machine is a Singer CG-590, relatively new, and the vinyl is Flexa, pretty common stuff. I have the correct needle for the thread and the machine is set up per mfr guide.
Using some scrap material the first thing I noticed was that the stitch length seemed awfully short. Even at max setting it looks to be about 1/16 inch, much shorter than on fabric. When I tried a French seam using Grosgrain as a support the machine would hardly pull it through. The feed dog seems to be working properly but maybe slipping on the vinyl? There's no adjustment for the height of the feed dog.
I'm hoping that some of you experts can point me in the right direction.
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By souperdoo
#11744
Your machine is not up to the task. It cannot pull the material through, thus the short stitches. It likely cannot handle anything greater than a T90 thread, and that would be through two layers of denim, canvas, Sunbrella, or D500 Cordura. It doesn't have the power to pierce three or four layers of material in a French seam or a flat-felled seam. Clearly, it is not capable of a top stitch through two layers of marine material.

There is a reason that upholsters use compound feed, or at least walking foot, machines that run off of 1hp motors rather than home sewing machines.

Look, I understand your situation. I have four PFAFF domestic machines from the '50s and '60s that are quite a bit more robust than your Singer CG-590 and they won't cut the mustard, either. I use them for work on materials that are less than D500 Cordura; materials that my Juki will just scrunch up and make a mess of. That's what they can do - different horses for different courses.

You are trying to do work with that machine that it was not intended to do. There's no magic needle, no magic foot, nor any magic spray for the thread, that will make a home machine do an upholstery job with heavy materials.

I understand that the 'CG' stands for Commercial Grade. That, however, is advertising hyperbole. You will not find this machine in any truly commercial application.
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By John Long
#11745
Unfortunately I have to agree with @souperdoo . Commercial Grade only means it is designed for continuous duty. Shirt factories run commercial machines but they are designed to sew light cotton not heavy duty vinyls.

I started out with a light duty walking foot machine and quickly realised I would have to upgrade to a machine designed to do what I wanted to do. The good news is, you can buy a good used commercial compound feed machine for less than the labor you will pay to have one interior job done. It will be money imvested, not just money spent.

Good luck as you move forward.

John Long
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By vicstric
#11756
First off... I am not one to get into forums and just go contrary to eveything that everyone says. The advise above is well founded and well worth taking into account. If you are wanting to get into this trade or to do a big project for yourself, then yes, read and follow the afore mentioned advise.

But... lol

What are you trying to sew? And What are your plans going forward? You did't mention if you were just recovering one chair or had intentions of a full ski boat upholstery job.

Whatever the case I wanted to share my story with other you and other beginners who may not have an extra $700+ to spend on even a budget walking foot machine.

I bought a Bass boat 5 years ago that I wanted to get the seats recovered on. I checked 3 local upholstery shops and got bids. I am not sure if the shops had kids they were trying to send to Harvard or what but I about died. The bids ranged from $1000 to $1200 and they didn't bat an eye telling me those estimates. Being the do-it-yourselfer that I am is said "@&*^ THAT!". So I bought some marine vinyl and told my daugher to break out her home sewing machine. We did some research and found we "needed" a teflon foot and a leather needle (one with a sharp, edged point.... They have a name which escapes me at the moment). Anyway we procured those and got some marine vinyl, #69 Bonded polyester thread and got to work.

At this point about all i knew about sewing you could write on a postage stamp. My daughter knew some. But here we went. Her machine was a simple Brother home sewing machine like you would sew clothes on. Nothing special. I would not even call it "heavy duty". Long story short, I learned a lot. But the seats turned out not too bad. They have been on the boat 4 years and are not perfect by any means but they look as good as the day we recovered them. And I had less than $200 in recovered seats. So far I have had NO stitches rip out.

Would I do it again? Maybe. Probably not. I watched a youtube video later on and the guy recommended NOT to start with bass boat seats because they are pretty complex. But this is where i started and I did learn a lot on this first project. I found I actually enjoyed it. Right after this I got a small portable walking foot sewing machine and did some other practice projest for myself. Before long I started doing work for friends. This machine also had drawbacks but I have done many jobs with it and have no complaints with it at all. But i recently aquired an industrial machine that i am getting very used to sewing with.

The stich length is in fact too short. At times it was scary to run the thickness of materials under the foot... and help was needed to feed. But it didn't seem like the machine was severly loaded punching the needle through. There was also flat- felled seams. If you are just wanting to do a small project for yourself here and there, get a teflon foot and a leather needle and give it a shot. You may find you want to do more and will be best served with getting a good walking foot machine as recommend above... and fYI... get with a servo motor.... :)

Best of luck to you going forward and revisit us often. There are some great folks here willing to help you.

Attached are before and after pics of the seats I patterned and cut out and my daughter sewed (mostly... I did some.) We litterally did the sewing on the kitchen table.


Image
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By MalcolmM
#12490
rdoty wrote: Wed Nov 18, 2020 3:28 am I'm not new to sewing but this is my first experience with marine vinyl and right away I'm having difficulty. My machine is a Singer CG-590, relatively new, and the vinyl is Flexa, pretty common stuff. I have the correct needle for the thread and the machine is set up per mfr guide.
Using some scrap material the first thing I noticed was that the stitch length seemed awfully short. Even at max setting it looks to be about 1/16 inch, much shorter than on fabric. When I tried a French seam using Grosgrain as a support the machine would hardly pull it through. The feed dog seems to be working properly but maybe slipping on the vinyl? There's no adjustment for the height of the feed dog.
I'm hoping that some of you experts can point me in the right direction.
Use V69 thread, buy a tefflon foot, use thread lubricant, try a "leather" needle #18. You may be able to sew heavy sticky materials with these modifications to a domestic machine. Expect to use the hand wheel a lot when crossing seams and get a "seam hopper" to help as you don't have a walking foot machine. My $0.02.
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By djdaveott
#12750
MalcolmM wrote:
rdoty wrote: Wed Nov 18, 2020 3:28 am I'm not new to sewing but this is my first experience with marine vinyl and right away I'm having difficulty. My machine is a Singer CG-590, relatively new, and the vinyl is Flexa, pretty common stuff. I have the correct needle for the thread and the machine is set up per mfr guide.
Using some scrap material the first thing I noticed was that the stitch length seemed awfully short. Even at max setting it looks to be about 1/16 inch, much shorter than on fabric. When I tried a French seam using Grosgrain as a support the machine would hardly pull it through. The feed dog seems to be working properly but maybe slipping on the vinyl? There's no adjustment for the height of the feed dog.
I'm hoping that some of you experts can point me in the right direction.
Use V69 thread, buy a tefflon foot, use thread lubricant, try a "leather" needle #18. You may be able to sew heavy sticky materials with these modifications to a domestic machine. Expect to use the hand wheel a lot when crossing seams and get a "seam hopper" to help as you don't have a walking foot machine. My $0.02.
This is what I did last year. 18 needle, V69 thread, teflon foot and so on. While it worked fairly well for someone with low expectations, here's my 2 cents since we're handing out pennies: Inside seams came out okay, but the top stitches never looked professional. The home sewing machine I purchased just couldn't do a long top stitch and often struggled to travel perfectly straight and had difficulty maintaining consistency on distance between each stitch over the length of the material. Needle deflection was a problem a time or two. Another problem I faced with a home machine was sewing boxing to the top material and getting the material to match...problem may have been solved with basting tape (double sided) or simply stapling materials together before sewing, so I'm not sure it that was the lack of walking foot to help pull fabric or my inexperience. Haven't had this problem with the Consew 206RB.

I propose this analogy: comparing a home sewing machine to an industrial walking foot machine is like trying to compare a daily driver car to a supercar. Yes, they do the same thing. But are they the same? Each has it's purpose.

If you're set on using that machine, maybe limit the amount of top stitching you do? Maybe do what you can and then take it to someone with a walking foot machine to do only the top stitch? I've been in your shoes, and spent $500 at the fabric store on a "heavy duty" sewing machine so I know exactly what you're going through. Having recently invested in a walking foot machine, I can tell you the difference is night and day. The walking foot machine will give you that top stitch you are looking for. Buy one, or pay a few bucks to have someone lay down that stitch for you. You won't be happy with the results from the Singer. Good luck.
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By MalcolmM
#12776
I had a similar experience moving from a "heavy duty" domestic sewing machine, to a portable walking foot machine and quickly ditching it for a "real" industrial sewing machine in a powerstand. No comparison when sewing heavy fabrics and using V92~V138 thread, domestic machines are not designed for it and never will be. Garment weight fabric and thread is what they are for and my Consew sucks for that so I kept the domestic machine for all my "light" work and gave away the portable walking foot to a buddy who has a boat and wants to make his own sail covers.
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